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Missouri / SEC Morning Minutes

It wouldn’t be morning in the SEC without a few Missouri headlines for you.  Whatever will we do when this move gets finalized?

As hard as it is to believe, from first mention to official confirmation, this Mizzou process still hasn’t equaled the length of Texas A&M’s waltz with the SEC.  It only seems like this has been going forever.

Some nuggets…

 

1.  As you know by now, Missouri chancellor Brady Deaton delayed a trip to India in order to continue working on more pressing matters for MU.  You can guess what those matters are.

2.  West Virginia filed a lawsuit against the Big East yesterday in an attempt to gain its immediate freedom from that conference.  The suit claims that commissioner John Marinatto didn’t do enough to protect the football-playing members of that league and that, in turn, breached the contract between the Big East and the school.  Yesterday afternoon on XM/Sirius Radio, WVU athletic director Oliver Luck flat-out said that the Mountaineers want to fill “Missouri’s slot” in the Big 12 next year.

3.  Meanwhile, South Carolina president Harris Pastides said in The State that “There is a prevailing positive viewpoint about (Missouri) becoming the 14th team” in the SEC.  ”Our decision on Missouri or any other candidate would depend on not creating a huge problem for the conference they’re leaving.”

 

For that reason, it’s believed Missouri has not officially asked for admittance into the SEC.  Remember that the SEC initially turned down Texas A&M’s bid — though not really — because the Aggies would have to take care of any legal entanglements before being welcomed in Mike Slive’s conference.  Eventually, the SEC voted to give A&M “conditional” acceptance and then that was finally changed to “unconditional” acceptance in late-September.

I spoke with a senior administrator at an SEC school this evening and ran the following scenario by him/her: “Is it likely, knowing how things were handled with A&M, that Mizzou and the SEC might have agreed that there is no need to apply right now, before the legal issues are hammered out?”

“You would probably be safe in that assessment,” I was told by the source.

Multiple rumors suggest the Big 12 is playing hardball regarding Mizzou’s exit penalty.  That sum is believed to be between $26 and $30 million.  Colorado and Nebraska negotiated their fees down last year.  It’s expected that Texas A&M has negotiated down its fee as well.  But word has it that the Big 12 isn’t interested in negotiating with MU.  The league could lose television revenue if it becomes a nine-team league next fall and if it can’t provide its television partners with the previously agreed upon number of games next season.

If WVU can’t extricate itself from the Big East immediately, the Big 12 would stay at 10 teams for 2012 and Missouri would likely face a smaller exit penalty.

 

In a press release last week, the Big 12 listed the schools it expects to have as members next year and Missouri was not among them.  WVU’s AD has publicly said that his school wants to fill Missouri’s slot in the Big 12 next summer.  The commissioner of the SEC has said that his league is still working on a 14-team schedule for football.  South Carolina president Harris Pastides says that he anticipates a vote on Missouri soon.  And MU officials said about 10 days ago that their chancellor has been given full power to hammer out a contract with another league… specifically mentioning the SEC and the fact that MU and the conference have already exchanged information.

As we said last Friday, this thing is as done as it can be.  In fact, we’re not sure that Missouri could even return to the Big 12 if it wanted to if West Virginia enters by next summer.  In that scenario, the Big 12 would then have to figure out an 11-team schedule and each school would lose money as the league upsized from 10 to 11 schools.

Once the Big 12 and Missouri work out an exit agreement — meaning fee — the SEC and the school will announce MU to the SEC East, likely for 2012.  But the longer this drags out — due to WVU’s situation and the Big 12′s refusal to negotiate — the less likely 2012 becomes.  If Deaton takes off for India in the next few days before an announcement is made, the odds of a 2013 entry into the SEC go up exponentially.

 

One last link for kicks — Those of you who think Missouri can’t play football, just check out Jeff Sagarin’s latest computer rankings.  Sure the Tigers are just 4-4 this year, but they’re #11 in the nation according to the silicon in his chips.  There ya go.

 


57 comments
AUgirl
AUgirl

Where did any of the SEC Board go to school? Do they know where Missouri is NOT in the SOUTH!! I can not believe the SEC has stooped to the level of whoever wants to come to the SEC come on. Are you kidding? Let's have a geography lesson and have the SOUTH EASTERN CONFERENCE be in the SOUTH!!

Terry
Terry

Is that skeleton Brady Deaton

Brad
Brad

Will today be the day?

Minnemo
Minnemo

@Bubba Gump
I think everyone on this site agrees that the SEC is the best football conference in the land. We'll see how the rankings look in a few weeks. I bet the SEC will look much better than the Bevo 12.

Spike
Spike

Missouri may need to get proactive and fight their own battle out of the Big Twelve. I know no one likes to, but there is a time and place to take legal action when you think you've be done wrong.

Brain
Brain

Bubba - The reason why MU has such a high SoS has nothing to do with their ooc games, it's really just because they've already played Ok, Ok St, Az St, K St, and A&M. All but Ok St. were on the road ta boot. 3 of the 5 are in the top 10 (according to his rankings) and the other 2 are in the top 20. LSU, Alabama, Arkansas, and SC have played 3 top 10 teams combined. SoS literally has nothing to do with how many games you've won but how strong your opponents are. It will change as the season goes on. All 4 of those teams are going to get a boost this weekend just because they play each other.

Guest
Guest

I want this all to end ASAP and Mizzou as the SEC's 14th team. And when that goal is done I'd like to hang Deloss Dodds and serve up Bevo off the spits!!!

the cisco kid
the cisco kid

The great majority of Missouri fans are looking forward to being in the SEC where all teams are treated the same and where unadulterated greed does not prevail. We know we have to upgrade our program to be competitive, and we will get it done. We played Oklahome tough at Norman and have a good chance to beat Texas at home. A truly fitting end to our stay in the Big 12 and good luck to Texas and OU who truly deserve each other (perhaps Texas even more)

Steven
Steven

Mr. Deaton was also the one in charge when OU,OSU,TT and Texas tried running out of the BIG 12 just a little over a month ago. They are only still there because the Pac 12 turned them down so they need to get off their high horse and let us go in my opinion.

AU4life
AU4life

You have to remember that mizzou's chancelor was running the madhouse for the past year and I'm sure there are a few hard feelings around those meetings. It would probably be better for mizzou if they had another liason that could deal with the big 12 instead of deaton.

Randy Sellers
Randy Sellers

It sounds like The Big 12 is playing some really hard ball with Mizzou and the amount of money it is going to take to leave for the SEC. $26M to $30M is a chunk of change if that is what the Big 12 is demanding.

ubeetiger
ubeetiger

thanks for all the info you provide. Best site I've found to keep up with Mizzou's struggles to vacate the mad house. Once we're part of the SEC I will continue checking your site often for up to date info on OUR conference.

AU4life
AU4life

Notre Dame, BYU Airforce. There's lots of candidates that could take over mizzou's schedule. Hell even Boise State would be a good football add for the big 12 but he said boise state's academics were just above a juco so that wouldn't likely happen. Supposedly Mizzou's Alumni are 100% behind this and they will come up with the money and be done with this, but who knows..

flswampman
flswampman

I am a consultant and have been working at UF for the last two weeks. I am in daily contact with some pretty important people there. From what I have been told the SEC is only speaking with Missouri to fill the 14th spot. I take this to mean that it is a done deal. Mike wants this done with as little hostilities as possible. Once Missouri works out with the big 12 how they will exit then Mike will make it official.

So, Mossouri needs to set down with the big 12. Tell them of your attention. Then try to work out an exit plan that suits everyone.

I believe this is pretty much done. It is only matter of when. I have not been very supportive of Missouri, but as I said it is inscapable now. So, Missouri welcome to the SEC! Ihope you win the big 12.

BRUCE
BRUCE

From an article I have just read concerning The Big East commissioner, he plans to not give in, that WVU will have to stay their 27 months, whch means The Big 12 will hold Mizzou, which means, that The SEC will be playing with just 11 members next year, and perhaps the year after that....... My confidence in Mizzou to the SEC, has taken a nose-dive as far as I am concerned...... I do not see things changing any time soon.......

UNLESS, someone else knows something I do not...........................

Dan B
Dan B

College sports is now a cesspool of greed. I went to Mizzou and this is just embarrassing. When will universities stop pretending football and basketball have anything to do with education?

AU4life
AU4life

Hey John, I have a buddy here in Dallas that works in the big 12 offices. He said everything was close to a done deal with the mizzou financials until the leak went out by mistake. He said that now the big 12 is playing uber hardball with mizzou for the big bucks. Something like nothing less than $30 mil unless west virginia gets to take over their schedule. I guess it's about the number 10 with all the games. He even said Kansas wants to fill the mizzou slot at arrowhead in kansas city with west virginia if they can get out of the big east. That would be a big slap in the face to mizzou. What do you think the chances of west virginia getting out of 27 mos or do you think mizzou will be in for one more year?

tradeassociation
tradeassociation

West Virginia is more than glad to pay the $10 million exit fee. They'd pay TWENTY million if it meant getting away now and earning much more than that in the Big 12 next year. Instead, the Big East needs/wants WVU, Pitt and Syracuse around because they need their computer numbers for the next round of BCS calculations. If those 3 schools leave now, then their computer numbers help their new leagues, the ACC and the Big 12. But if they stick around, then their computer numbers help the Big East retain their AQ status for a few more years. The hope is that during that time, UConn, Rutgers, Louisville, Cincinnati, USF and whoever else the Big East invites (i.e. Houston, Boise, UCF) will perform well enough to retain the Big East's AQ status. It has a shot at working. Remember, last time newcomers UConn, Louisville and Cincinnati won a combined 4 Big East titles and USF became a regular fixture in bowl games, and in the process they outperformed some of the current and future expatriates (i.e. Syracuse, Boston College and Pitt, who have 1 Big East title in the BCS era between them).

Houston and Boise have stronger computer numbers than Pitt and Syracuse, but those numbers - and UCF's numbers - help C-USA and the WAC for BCS AQ league purposes (remember, this is Boise's first year in the MWC). The Big East needs WVU, Pitt and Syracuse to stick around until Houston, Boise and UCF's numbers start counting for the Big East. The sad part is that the football schools wanted to add these schools - and TCU - years ago, but the basketball schools kept blocking it. Had the basketball schools allowed the football schools to get to 12 teams and have a conference championship game, the result would have been a huge and competitive TV deal from ESPN, and more money to the basketball schools as a result. But the basketball schools were more concerned with their ability to control the Big East than the extra revenue or stability. Even now, it is debatable whether the basketball schools will ever allow enough football schools in the Big East for the football league to be viable.

John
John

If we really have to wait for the lawsuit between WVU and the Big East to be worked out, this could take a LOOONG time. I am not patient. I just say Get er done.

By the way, this is a terrific site.

John

Jim Moro
Jim Moro

Almost everyone that follows Missouri football and athletics is in 100% support of this move. Missouri will have to 'recruit up' a bit once in the SEC. Florida, here we come! We also appreciate the support we have recieved on this site and elsewhere in the SEC. Columbia, MO is a great college town and we all look forward to our trips down south. GO TIGERS!

Bubba Gump
Bubba Gump

John,

A big part of that #11 ranking is Sagarin rates MU with the #1 SoS schedule and KU has the #2. He has LSU at #18 and Alabama at #39. MU played Miami OH (3-5 in MAC), ASU (6-2 in PAC), and W Illinois (2-6 in MVC). KU played McNeese State (3-5 Southland), N Illinois (5-3 MAC), and Georgia Tech (7-2 ACC). ASU is #19 in the BCS and Georgia Tech is #23 in the BCS. LSU played Oregon (7-1 PAC), NW State (5-3 Southland), and West Virginia (6-2 BE). Alabama played Kent State (2-6 MAC), Penn State (8-1 B1G ), and N Texas(3-6 Sun Belt). Oregon #8 in the BCS, West Virginia is #24 in the BCS, and Penn State is #16 in the BCS.

LSU is 8-0, and Oregon > Arizona State in BCS + West Virginia > any second OOC opponent for MU or KU
Alabama is 8-0, and Penn State > Arizona State & Georgia Tech in BCS

I find it hard to believe that 2 undefeated schools with better records against better competition have such poor SoS numbers and MU and KU have better SoS numbers for losing to lower ranked BCS schools. The SEC is the toughest conference, and has proved such in the past 5 years, yet even with better OOC BCS wins one barely makes the top 20 SoS and the other is sitting closer to 40. The only SEC vs B12 matchup so far the season was Arkansas #61 SoS beating TAMU #5 SoS on a neutral field. Pardon me if I think Sagarin has rated the B12 schools SoS higher than they should be, and the SEC schools lower than they should be. Guess the SEC will have to beat the B12 in the MNC yet again to show their SoS is yet again under rated even tho they have won the past 5 MNC's.

So far it has been
LSU 21 Oklahoma 14
Florida 24 Oklahoma 14
Alabama 37 Texas 21
SEC ?? B12 ?? in January ??

John Bechtel
John Bechtel

I want to thank you for your coverage. I'm a Mizzou alumni and I've discovered this is definitely the go to website for information about the SEC. Keep up the good work.

GUEST
GUEST

SEC and BIG 12 schools should "pass the hat" and pay whatever fee the Big East would want for WVUs early release. It would seam to benefit all parties greatly and in the end would be a drop in the bucket.

gatorinOK
gatorinOK

For a better look at MIZZOU footballs power, check out the Massey Football Power ratings. Now check the MIZOU roster and see how many TEXANS are on the team . In 4 years there will be few Texans on the team , but, I am sure that FLORIDA recruits will rush in to fill those spots .

JD1
JD1

Excellent analysis as always. I think it's clear that the SEC is wanting to avoid being involved in any legal quagmires. As usual the big 12 is playing a stall game with both mizzou and aTm. They're trying to screw over both sides and don't want to set the price too low. Again, IMO it's up to the big 12 to fill the slot. If they choose to wait for WVU they can only blame themselves.

Bubba Gump
Bubba Gump

Look at it with both combined, and tell me which had the tougher schedule :

Sat, Sept 3 vs #3 Oregon* AWAY W 40-27
Sat, Sept 10 vs Northwestern State home W 49-3
Thu, Sept 15vs #25 Mississippi State AWAY (and on a short week) W 19-6
Sat, Sept 24 vs #16 West Virginia AWAY W 47-21
Sat, Oct 1 vs Kentucky home W 35-7
Sat, Oct 8 vs #17 Florida home W 41-11
Sat, Oct 15 @ Tennessee AWAY W 38-7
Sat, Oct 22 vs #20 Auburn W 45-10

That is 5 ranked teams including the previous NC in Auburn (6-3), and the previous runner up in Oregon (7-1) and beat 4 ranked teams on the road. Auburns 3 losses were to Clemson, Arkansas, and LSU who are all at the top of the current BCS rankings.

Sat, Sept 3 vs Miami (OH) home W 17-6
Fri, Sept 9 vs Arizona State AWAY L 37-30 OT
Sat, Sept 17 vs Western Illinois home W 69-0
Sat, Sept 24 vs #1 Oklahoma AWAY L 38-28
Sat, Oct 8 vs #20 Kansas State AWAY L 24-17
Sat, Oct 15 vs Iowa State home W 52-17
Sat, Oct 22 vs #4 Oklahoma State home L 45-24
Sat, Oct 29 vs #16 Texas A&M AWAY W 38-31 OT

That is 4 ranked teams split 3-1 in AWAY vs home. I am happy to acknowledge the Oklahoma and Oklahoma State games as being the toughest on the Missouri schedule. I said all season that KSU had a weak schedule and it would show later in the season, and now it has. I really think TAMU is a top 20 team, heck they may even be a top 10 team if only their first half scores counted. They seem incapable of actually beating anybody in a full game. Arizona State played the Trojans and the Ducks, but they do not play Stanford unless they make the PAC CCG. The rest of their schedule is a whole lot of nothing.

Brain, it should be based on games played in total including both conference and non conference games. Not sure how you think the SEC schools have played such a weak schedule as I feel sure no coach in america relishes the thought of playing the defending National Champion or the defending Runner Up, or facing the cowbells in StarkVegas on a short week. LSU faced WVU @ Mountaineer Field and UT @ Neyland. The Tide faced a 7-1 Penn State team in front of ~ 108,000 JoPa fans before playing at the Swamp in front of ~91,000 angry Gator fans. Arkansas beat a TAMU team you claimed as a ranked team for the MU schedule then went to Brant - Denny's ~ 102,000 and faced their fans. South Carolina had to play between the hedges in front of ~ 93,000 Dawgs fans before heading up I - 75 to face 97,000 Vol fans. In StarkVegas the Cocks faced an average B12 crowd, but nobody in the B12 has to play in front of the cowbells. None of this adds in the tough schools all played at home! LSU got the Gators & Auburn at home, BAMA got the Hogs & Vols at home, Arkansas got Auburn at home, and South Carolina got Auburn at home.

All these games have already been played by SEC schools, and still I am willing to bet any coach would prefer the Missouri schedule so far this season to the LSU or Alabama schedule. This is before this weekend where the two have to play each other. You could add Arkansas and / or South Carolina as having tougher schedules than MU has faced so far. Playing in hostile 80,000 - 100,000 stadiums is just not the same as playing in B12 stadiums not in Norman or College Station - Austin has a corporate wine and cheese crowd feel. A mid level SEC team should be 6-2 or better against the MU schedule so far, while a mid level B12 could easily be 2-6 playing the LSU schedule so far! Fill in the blanks so far, and look at the match ups if you feel I am so wrong here.

deltaboy
deltaboy

What the Big 12 [aka "The Texas League"] should do is add Houston or SMU for 2012 & then add WVU [if they must commit that geographic atrocity] & someone else whenever they are free. I know it will never happen because that's not what Texas wants, but it sure would cure a lot of ills.

StL
StL

As I've posted on here a couple of times, the big 12 could find a team for 2012 if it was that important to them. Holding out for WVU is their problem, not mizzou's or the SEC's. Boise would probably join tomorrow, cesspool and all.

PNB
PNB

the SEC currently has 12 schools and will go to at least 13 next season not 11

Thetruth
Thetruth

They never will so long as it brings in the big bucks.

Garret
Garret

That link is a very good read. It is sickening how ESPN has its fingers in the conference realignments. I also clicked the link in the story "ESPN's Contract Issues with Texas A&M Illustrate Larger ESPN Problem" & found that even more intriguing.

Not only does it appear that ESPN is a driving force behind conference(s) realignment, but ESPN will be the reason why conferences like the Big 12 & Big East won't lose their BCS bids as the lucrative television network will maintain the status quo to avoid hundreds of millions of dollars in lawsuits and exposure of what they've been up to over the years.

JD1
JD1

If WVU's agreement with the big 12 is anything like TCU's, they won't be making anywhere near that money for some time. TCU won't get a full share until year 5. It goes something like 50%, 68%, 75%, 84% and then 100%. The big 12 is already making their new members pay for the exit of the old ones.

tradeassociation
tradeassociation

Missouri can still recruit Texas by having A&M as their annual rival, and by judiciously scheduling road OOC games against the likes of Rice, SMU, UTEP etc. Meanwhile, they will gain more talent from Florida, South Carolina and Georgia than they will lose from Texas. The same is true of A&M by the way ... they'll gain more from Louisiana, Mississippi and Alabama than they will lose from Texas. That is the benefit of playing in the SEC ... the recruiting is much more wide open, especially when you consider the raids into ACC territory that SEC East teams make (recruiting in North Carolina, Maryland and Virginia).

johnmrsec
johnmrsec

Bubba Gump...

I was actually kidding about that rating. I'm not big on computer rankings and I can't believe a 4-4 squad would really be ranked #11 in a poll.

John

StevenBrew
StevenBrew

Not saying the BIG12 is better than the SEC this year but it is pretty darn good. Although top to bottom I could see the argument that it may be. Mizzou played ASU,OSU,OU,aTm and KSU. That is pretty tough if you ask most. A combined 33-7 record. If I am not mistaken the SOS is based off the teams you play not your record. There is no doubt next week LSU and AL will shoot up in the SOS category.

Steven
Steven

For some reason they are catering to the Big 12 in rankings this year it seems. Kansas State got rolled by Oklahoma last week which to me shows that they aren't as good as advertised and believe me Oklahoma St. wont remain unbeaten. They only beat Missouri because of erratic play by a young inexperienced QB and they still have Kansas State and Oklahoma to play. But when a league has 4 of the top 9 BCS schools and 6 teams in the top 25 the strength of schedule is bound to be higher and 5 of Missouri's 8 games have been against top 20 teams with 4 of those being on the road. As more Big 12 teams lose those SoS ratings should drop.

HoustonVol
HoustonVol

It is really not about passing the hat. It is about maintaining a minimum number of teams to still count as a conference, and maintaining TV deals intact. What is worth more? $30 million now and having your conference fall apart or keeping your conference together for a year or two by force, keeping your TV contracts and AQ status as a conference. As of right now there is not any amount of money that could be collected to off set the long term impact on the Big East and B12. So the B12/Mizzou and SEC are taking their time to destroy the Big East. With the Big East gone, it free up a BCS bid that then could be a 3rd bid for one of the power conferences. It helps eliminate an unattractive TV product, and programs that do not sell tickets. Example - how many people watched the Uconn BCS bowl last year??? If the Big East allows the teams to just walk away and lose the AQ status or falls apart as a conference, then any program left behind will drop down a level. The same reason Baylor was fighting like heck to maintain the B12 a month ago. There is a huge financial impact of not being in a AQ conference.

Steven
Steven

Missouri has lost 4 games but to the 3rd, 6h,15th and 16th place teams on Massey's list while in a year where their best offensive player and defensive player left early for the NFL draft. QB Gabbert drafted 10th and DE Aldon Smith drafted 7th leaving a very inexperienced QB behind. 1 game they lost when their senior All-American kicker who had missed 3 field goal attempts in his entire career missed a short field goal as time ran out. It would have won the game but instead they ended up losing in OT. They haven't really been blown out by any of them and erratic play by an inexperienced QB can be linked to having cost at-least 1 if not 2 other loses.

As for Texas recruits I would bet they schedule a Texas school like SMU,Houston or Rice every year and if they get Texas A&M as permanent rivalry they can keep a footprint in Texas. Plus one thing recruits look at I believe is the programs NFL drafted players and MU can boast about having 5 1st round picks in the last 3 years along with a 2nd, some 3rds an several others as well. On top of that they are moving to the best conference there is and they're pretty good recruiters so it shouldn't hurt in my opinion.

Yule
Yule

If I were in King in the Big 12, I would tell the Big East to wave the 27 month hold and cut WVU loose otherwise I am inviting LU to join as well. If that is not successful, I would invite BYU to fill in as the 10th team starting 2012. I know the networks object to BYU because their teams do not want to play on Sunday, but the networks can either allow BYU to join or allow the Big 12 to run with 9 teams for a couple seasons without voiding the TV contracts. The networks can not have it both ways. If the networks are still against BYU joining, then I would also invite Cincinnati to join to get the number of universities up to 12. Maybe if the Big 12 invites 3 teams, the Big East is done as a football conference and all the 27 month holds periods go away.

By the way, isn't a 27 month delay for WVU to join really mean they would be held until the 2014-1015 season?

Of course, since UT is really the King and they want WVU to complete a 10 team league and as such we have to wait for the current mess to play out. I am sure Mr. Brady Deaton is in constant contact with the SEC to let them know the latest developments in regard to Missouri's exit from the Big 12. So like the proverbial duck on a pond, everything seems calm on the outside, but underneath the duck is churning like mad.

Brain
Brain

I had a second part to this post but it seems to have gotten lost. The long and short of it was that the SEC is 4/6 in OOC BCS games while the Big 12 is 6/8. What hasn't been taken into account yet is that the SEC still has more of these games coming up.

Also don't forget when you look at that sites SoS ranking that it's based upon that sites overall rankings not BCS rankings. When I looked over all of games that the top 4 in the SEC had played. They had combined to play 3 top 10 schools and 2 more in the top 30 (again only according to that sites rankings). Mizzou has played 3 top 10 with 2 more in the top 30 already. Mizzou's schedule will start to get easier while the SEC schedule is going to get tougher. I'm not trying to tell you which league is tougher...I really don't know. I will say that the SEC has the 2 best teams in the country and their SoS is going to get a big boost throughout the next few weeks just from them all playing each other.

hangtime79
hangtime79

Yea, but you know Mizzou doesn't have to leave either so it is their problem. Just like OU was the problem before now its Mizzou. However, Mizzou can't dynamite the conference thus they why we are all sitting at a stand still.

tradeassociation
tradeassociation

Wow. Then you have to wonder how WVU's jumping ship benefits them then, as the Big 12's existence after year 6, the first year that they get a full share, isn't guaranteed! Is the Big East's TV contract so bad that 50% in the Big 12 (though granted the Big 12 did just sign a VERY BIG contract) more than 100% of the Big East? You'd also figure that WVU would have a much better shot at winning the Big East, where it is them, Pitt, Syracuse, Louisville, USF etc. than they would against Texas and Oklahoma (and Big 12 referees, as Nebraska fans can tell you about), and getting back to a couple of BCS games that would help their cause in the next expected round of realignment than finishing 4th in the Big 12 (which still won't be regarded as a strong conference) would. It is very curious that TCU and West Virginia (and apparently Louisville) are a lot more confident about the Big 12's long term future than Missouri is.

Steven
Steven

Plus it's not hard to sell to a kid that is looking for an NFL career that one of the best ways to get there is through the SEC. If the school talking to them has kids getting drafted in the 1st round they should be able to sell their school to the kid in my opinion.

Bubba Gump
Bubba Gump

John,

If it was about SoS a 0 - 12 team should be in the number #1 slot but feel computer bias - the old garbage in, garbage out theory - exists because rankings do seem skewed. The SoS should be better for the B12 schools if Florida State, Miami FL, TCU, Arizona, UCLA, and the like had actually been competitive this year, but since they were not, the SoS numbers should fall. Aside from the SEC conference being a brutal leveler, the SEC schools add at least 1 OOC game via OOC rival or a good FBS school. Everybody acted like Alabama beating Penn State was no big deal yet the Nittany Lions are sitting on only 1 loss late in the season. To look at it another way, had the Penn State folks not gone on a limb and scheduled the Tide, they would be UNDEFEATED right now, and possibly in the top 5 in the BCS. Sagarin gives JoPa's teams a SoS of #64 as is, so no telling where it would be without this 1 game.

I always thought there was regional and "balance" issues that infiltrate the polls. Arizona State is such a "balance" school in that pollsters seem to think the PAC should have 3 teams in the top 25. ASU's 1 quality win was Southern Cal, and this year the Trojans scraped by a 2-6 Minnesota team by 2 points, a 4-4 Utah team, and a 2-6 Arizona team by 1 touchdown. It is like pollsters feel they have to have a PAC 12 south school in the polls even if their performance and opponents do not warrant it. I feel Texas is getting this treatment as well based on the their weak resume. They open beating a 2-6 Rice team, and follow it up with a 1 point BYU win in AUSTIN. This same BYU team squeaked out a 1 point win the week before against the worst SEC team. They closed out the OOC with a lopsided win against a 4-4 UCLA team that got their hat handed to them when they played bottom feeder Arizona. 2-2 in conference with a blowout from OU, and blowing out hapless KU is not a ringing endorsement for a #21 BCS ranking, yet there they are.

If they are gonna let these guys vote they should have to see more actual games before allowing a vote to be cast. Sorry to get so testy but rankings are one of the worst things in college football since they put too much weight on preseason bias. Just like the BCS does not start till later, they should ban polls till the week 5 or 6 of the season. Sadly, that will never happen.

Bubba Gump
Bubba Gump

I thought it was supposed to be based on the whole 120 and how they do relative to each other. My point was to compare head to head with #1 MU vs # 18 LSU AND # 2 KU with # 39 Alabama (I was to lazy to Alabama and KU, but you are welcome to)

Quality SEC wins : LSU vs Oregon 7-1, LSU vs WVU 6-2, Alabama vs Penn State 8-1, Tennessee vs Cincinnati 6-1, Arkansas beat TAMU 5-3 in the only B12 vs SEC matchup so far.
Quality B12 wins : Texas vs BYU 6-3, ISU vs Iowa 5-3, OU vs FSU 5-3 is the best there was.

SEC OOC losses = UGA vs #5 Boise State 8-0, Auburn vs #11 Clemson, Ole Miss vs BYU 6-3, UK vs UL 4-4
B12 OOC losses = TAMU vs #7 Arkansas, Missouri vs #19 ASU, KU vs #23 Ga Tech

LSU vs MU strongest to weakest

#1 LSU (8-0) plays #2 Alabama (8-0) vs Missouri (4-4) plays #3 Oklahoma State (8-0) = LSU has tougher game
#1 LSU (8-0) plays #7 Arkansas (7-1) vs Missouri (4-4) plays #6 Oklahoma (7-1) = MU with LSU about equal
#1 LSU (8-0) plays #8 Oregon (7-1) vs Missouri (4-4) plays #14 Kansas State (7-1) = LSU has much tougher game
#1 LSU (8-0) plays #22 Auburn (6-3) vs Missouri (4-4) plays #19 ASU (6-2) = MU with LSU about equal
#1 LSU (8-0) plays #24 West Virginia (7-1) vs Missouri (4-4) plays #21 Texas (5-2) = MU with LSU about equal
#1 LSU (8-0) plays Florida (4-4) vs Missouri (4-4) plays TAMU (5-3) = MU with tougher game ??
#1 LSU (8-0) plays Mississippi State (4-4) vs Missouri (4-4) plays Texas Tech (5-3) = MU tougher game ??
#1 LSU (8-0) plays Tennessee (3-5) vs Missouri (4-4) plays Baylor (4-3) = MU tougher game ??
#1 LSU (8-0) plays Kentucky (3-5) vs Missouri (4-4) plays Iowa State (4-4) = MU with tougher game ??
#1 LSU (8-0) plays Mississippi (2-6) vs Missouri (4-4) plays Kansas (2-6) = LSU with tougher game*
#1 LSU (8-0) plays WKU (4-4) vs Missouri (4-4) plays Miami OH (3-5) = LSU with tougher game
#1 LSU (8-0) plays NW La St (5-3) vs Missouri (4-4) plays W Illinois (2-6) = LSU with tougher game

SEC OOC losses = UGA vs #5 Boise State 8-0, Auburn vs #11 Clemson, Ole Miss vs BYU 6-3, UK vs UL 4-4
B12 OOC losses = TAMU vs #7 Arkansas, Missouri vs #19 ASU, KU vs #23 Ga Tech
*While Ole Miss and KU are 2-6, BYU lost to ranked Texas by 1 point, and beat SEC cellar dweller by 1 point (2pts total)

Again, not saying the B12 is terrible, just saying the SEC is better, and the SEC played and won the tougher OOC schedule, yet was not rewarded for doing so. Part of this may have been the over valuation of the BU vs TCU and ISU vs Iowa wins that were not the power of their former selves at the start of the season. Also, I do feel Texas has been about 5 slots higher than they should have been due to the desire to sell the LHN. It is easier to sell premium value content for a ranked team than one that is not.

Mark
Mark

Amen, Brother Steven

mitchs3
mitchs3

I read the WVU lawsuit yesterday which did finally clear up one item I had been curious about, which is whether the Big East basketball schools got to vote on football matters - the suit makes clear they do, and cites that as one of the reasons they think they should be able to get out. Assuming this is right, and extrapolating it to the next step - that the BE basketball schools get a cut of the Big East BCS $ - then I bet they will play this hand out to the end. Even if the B12 takes Louisville and Cincinnati, combined with WVU, TCU, Pitt and Syracuse, leaving only 3 football schools (UConn, Rutgers and USF), the BE will still dig in their heels to try and keep the BCS $. What do the BBall schools have to lose?

Steven
Steven

Actually if a quote I read on this site is correct it sounds like the SEC very much in the loop on it. They said one of their sources said that the Big 12 isn't the only ones with lawyers looking over the rules closely or something like that.

StL
StL

big 12 has some responsiblility to mitigate here. They can't just sit back. UT-Austin, UT- Lubbock, UT-Stillwater, & UT-Norman all tried to leave. They can't exactly play the victim card because that didn't work out. Do you think each of those 4 schools would have coughed up $30 million?

Steven
Steven

Tradeassociation:
I guess it's because WVU,TCU and Louisville weren't in the big 12 a month or so ago when Mr. Boren was trying to take OU,OSU,TT and Texas to the Pac 12 only to be turned down by Larry Scott on September 20th. Personally I can't see a conference as stable that just a month ago 5 members were leaving and 4 of them only returned because they were turned down. And 1 of the refuses to go back to 12 universities and wont go higher than to commit to the Big 12 for more than 6 years. The funny thing is most of the schools wanted a longer commitment and 12 schools but they were all out voted by 1 school. So, it looks to me like they went right back to licking Bevo's boots. Missouri said sorry guys we aren't licking Bevo's boots anymore we're going to accept an invite to the BEST conference going we're off to the SEC.

Steven
Steven

Yeah but Neinas doesn't run the conference and I wonder how much he knows. He was saying up until the day Texas A&M left that they weren't gone and he could get them to stay. He's also the one who said Missouri didn't tell the league they were withdrawing but yet the league presidents were told that MU wants to work out an exit deal and they were negotiating it supposedly.. How can Mr. Deaton not have told them Missouri was leaving if he asked them to work out an exit deal. Working out an exit deal means were leaving so let us know what we need to get out of here.

JD1
JD1

I originally read those figures from the Ft. Worth Star-Telegram when TCU joined 3 or 4 weeks ago. Neinas contradicted that when WVU was announced. He said that WVU would get a full share right away. When questioned about TCU, Neinas replied that TCU and WVU had a "similar" deal. It's possible the Ft. Worth paper was inaccurate with their original numbers.

johnmrsec
johnmrsec

Steven...

That is correct. We were told that by an SEC school official last week (or the week before, this all runs together at this point). The problem is, if one group won't negotiate at all it leaves things in a bit of a fix.

Thanks for reading,
John

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